Is your TV really HD??

[wrnglrptch]

I know with HD TV prices dropping everyday, everyone is rushing out to buy one. But before you do lets look at what makes an HDTV. Acording to the so called standard, anything above 480p is HDTV, but is it enough to make you go WOW! Most people dont get the WOW effect until they see 720p. So how does all this translate into current TV Sets avialable. Lets look at some of the physics behind what it takes to create each different type of signal.

Lets take CRTs to start. Here are the min. size CRT that it take to reproduce Each Signal Type

1080i - 9" CRTs (Yes most will do 1080p also)
720p - 7" CRTs
540p - 5" CRTs
Most of the new cheaper sets are only using 5" CRTs, so even when they say 1080i, what they mean is they will can handle the signal in and then they will downconvert it to whatever the CRTs will actually handle.

What about those of you that have DLP or LCD based units, or even front projectors.. well you are not in much better shape. There is only one single lens projector that I know of that will do a 1080i (actually it will do a 1080p), and that is the top of the line DILA unit from JVC, which has a suggested retial price of somewhere around $225,000.00 So where does your unit fit in.. Find the resolution that the chip in the projector will actually do and compare to the chart below.

16x9 Format

1080p - 1920x1080
1080i - 1920x540
720p - 1280x720
720i - 1280x360
540p - 960x540
540i - 960x270
480p - 860x480
480i - 860x240

4x3 Format

1080p - 1460x1080
1080i - 1460x540
720p - 960x720
720i - 960x360
540p - 720x540
540i - 720x270
480p - 640x480
480i - 640x240

This is all based on physics, I am not trying to blow smoke up someone's butt, and actually I am in the Audio/Video Industry, I am just trying to make an aware consumer. What I am plan on doing over the next few weeks is editing this post and adding TVs that meet atleast the 720p format. And before the flames start, I know they are out there, I just dont have time to start adding them now. :-)

[wrnglrptch]

OK, Below I will list TV and Projectors that will do a true 720p or better. I am also going to include either street price or retial which ever I can find. Please bare with me as I will update this over several weeks. If you have one to add to the list please PM me instead of posting here. If you have a comment about one then please post below.

55" - 73" Televisions
Zenith D60WLCD 60" - 720p - $7000.00
Zenith IQB64W10W 64" - 1080i - $8000.00
Zenith D65W25 65" - 720p - $3500.00


37" - 54" Televisions
Zenith D52WLCD 50" - 720p - $6000.00
Panasonic PT-65WX51 65" - 720p - $3500.00
JVC AV-48WP30 48" - 720p - TBD

10" - 36" Televisions




LCD Projectors




DLP/D-ILA Projectors
Selco Sim2 HT300 - 720p - $16,000.00
JVC DLA-QX1G - 1080p - $225,000.00
JVC (Rest of DILA Line) - 720p - $14,000.00 - $75,000.00




CRT Projectors
Zenith Pro1200 - 1080p - $30,000.00
Zenith Pro900x - 720p - $8000.00

Added a few more today - (6-12-02)

[oldschoolwizard2000]

sony wega 36" xbr series states it does 1080i

[wrnglrptch]

All Direct view Tube televisions that are HD, more then likely do 1080i or 1080p. There is no way to judge if they are truely HD based on specs. They could be downgrading a signal, but unfortunatlly no way to verify this...

[Mr. President]

Lets take CRTs to start. Here are the min. size CRT that it take to reproduce Each Signal Type

I don't think this is accurate. Mitsubishi is using a 7" CRT for its 65" RPTV that is 1080i.

[brannicj]

wrnglrptch:

I have read something like this before, but I am not sure if I completely understand it. Obviously, the larger the CRT the greater number of pixels can be generated. (that make complete sense)

I am very confused though. I have a Toshiba 42" widescreen and I think it only has 7" crts but the listed resolution on toshiba canada website is 1600 lines of horizontal resolution. Meaning its native resolution is 1600 x 540 which would have enough resolution to be considered 1080i and not 720P. So does this mean that toshiba is lying about its true horizontal resolution or does this mean newer design crts are capable of the minimum 1080i requirements?


Now I did look at the Panasonic 47" 16x9 hdtv and it says that it only has 850 lines of resolutions, which I think would put it in the category of 480P, 850x480? (is that correct)

[wrnglrptch]

Yes and no on your Toshiba set. They can legally claim 1600 lines of resolution. Here is the reason why:

7" CRTs are nativily able to display 850 lines of resolution, but with a little processing, and some tricks of the mirror, that can produce 1600 line in a interlaced manor. Basically here is what toshiba is doing... They are drawing the first line at the top of the screen, then doing an electronic shift of the image inside the crt, then drawing the next line down, back to normal shift, draw the next line, etc... With the right focal distances, and mirror placement then will give you a 1080i image. Is it true 1080i?? In my book no, because they are shifting the image inside the CRT before it is displayed. Which can effect picture quality.

As far as the 65" Mits goes, like I said, they can claim that it will acept a 1080i signal, they even trick most people by displaying whatever the incoming signal is up on the TV in nice bold letters.. Physic will not allow a 7" CRT to reproduce a 1080i signal without electronicly processing the signal some how.

Back to the Panasonic 47", I personally sell the model because its a beatiful set for the money, but yes you are correct, native it will only do a 480p signal.

I am just trying to make the average consumer aware what is happening in the HD market. I know I didnt get any more models added today, I am sorry, I will work on this as I have time, today was way to hetic, I am actually at home now, just trying to stay one step ahead of dave. :-)

IF anyone wants to ask me questions concerning any of this outside this thread fell free to PM, I will try to explain in more detial....

[mattclarke]

can someone tell me what my 42" Sony LCD grand wega does?

cheers,

[PMK]

So what will my 53" Panasonic do? PT-53WX53

I'm just curious...

[caseyrebel]

Ok,I contacted Sony about their TV systems,they do not have as far as I could gather from all the info given to me by the person I talked to have any TVs ready to receive the whole HDTV signal ready to view/listen (audio,yes,AC-3)...They do incorporate what they call a AC-3 Decoder that is solely for Audio on in Dolby 5.1(5-Channel Audio) and this does NOT cover the VIDEO side of that format of this HDTV signal,plus they have an ATSC(Advaced Televisions Stsytems Connecting)Tuner built in for receiving HDTV signals ..You will still need the extra Decoder(as much as I could gather)that decrypts all of the signal to see the whole HDTV broadcast such as I have with my C-band unit...I do have another phone number at Sony to contact about this and I will make that call later today...Sony has 3 sets that have the AC-3 Audio and they are a 51',57",and 65" sets that are ready for only AC-3 Audio only and not for the Video side of HDTV signals...Smaller sets are not capable of receiving the Dolby 5.1 True Surround Sound(AC-3) making them a less perfect match for any system out there that will allow you to receive any HDTV signals available,Sat/Off-Air...I will post any and all findings for those that want the WHOLE picture instead of just the HDTV signal that looks like its a HDTV complete picture,but it's not by far...There is a great difference when you add the Decoder(HDD200 HDTV Decoder) that is offered by Motorola for the viewing of HDTV complete audio/video signal...The C-Band unit DSR922 4DTV Receiver(I use)does incorporate the AC-3 Audio Compressed Decoder for the audio side and not for the video side of the HDTV format for viewing...This means that you will NOT get the whole picture unless a HDTV Decoder for the video side is in between the Receiver and TV for viewing,then you will get the whole HDTV viewing/sound,not just the Dolby 5.1 sound quality with reduced fuzziness of the picture with crisp clear five-channel audio....I do have this and looks/sounds extremely great for up close/far viewing/sound as you have never seen/heard before except for seeing the TRUE eye/ear view/sound that you would only see if you are looking outside or even in house,then its not as well as HDTV....I like to try and stay on top of all this,plus I do enjoy the unit I have with a 48" TV(still have a black top and bottom on the screen,since not 16:9 Aspect TV,is a 4;3 Aspect instead)...Later I will try and get back with a post of more info on this for all after I contact this other phone number I was gave to contact for more in-depth info on their TVs w/HDTV AC-3 Tuners...Calling and asking all the exact questions is a great importance if you want the whole story behind HDTV,plus follow up on any leads you find or are given about this industry of a new world of TV viewing/listening...LATER...

Posted by matteclarke,
can someone tell me what my 42" Sony LCD grand wega does?

cheers,

Need to call Sony and ask..LCDs are very great to watch,since the piture quality is extremely great...They are not ready completely for HDTv,but do have pixels beyond compare to some sets out there..I have seen this set and yes,it's great for viewing HDTV,but imagine what this set will do with true HDTV reception with a HDTV Decoder for viewing the video/sound of the HDTV signals...Call Sony and inquire,but ask all the questions about everything you can thats posted here about receiving such signals...Just a thought for ya...